[BUSINESS] Basic principles for seeking video and photo content

[BlazeMaker]

blazemaker take a tip from Filmlatez, Colmike7, Bill, brassmonkey....... they are all on the forums to do business but they help and share ideas.

Sure.
Read this thread, I am sharing ideas on how to get a good result quickly.

[saucyadele]

This can be so good yet I feel there is tension going on.

[BlazeMaker]

This can be so good yet I feel there is tension going on.

Yeah, bizarre isn't it. The topic is clearly labelled "BUSINESS" and was posted to prompt a dispassionate and professional discussion of a better approach to commissioning or otherwise sourcing video content.

[T.B.W]

He only wants to make money nothing else.

[HeidiHoe]

Hey blazemaker! So how long have you been involved in adult?

I can understand your frustration with tedious back and forth that may not yield immediate results, however you could easily use it to your advantage to build your rapport and reputation leading to future ongoing sales. Why not just shoot back a canned email when you get a rate request? It would take a few seconds to send the ball back to their court and with the right attitude it just might bear fruit. To sell a product you need to sell yourself.

Your thread most definitely has a lot of merit and I understand your frustration with the (lack of) process, however you do come across a little bit antagonistic and I don't see how this helps. Just sayin...

[BlazeMaker]

Hey blazemaker! So how long have you been involved in adult?

I can understand your frustration with tedious back and forth that may not yield immediate results, however you could easily use it to your advantage to build your rapport and reputation leading to future ongoing sales. Why not just shoot back a canned email when you get a rate request? It would take a few seconds to send the ball back to their court and with the right attitude it just might bear fruit. To sell a product you need to sell yourself.

Your thread most definitely has a lot of merit and I understand your frustration with the (lack of) process, however you do come across a little bit antagonistic and I don't see how this helps. Just sayin...

Thanks for actually addressing the post, and yes I do usually shoot back an email that highlights why asking for rates will not result in a meaningful production budget.
I have been doing adult as an aside to mainstream film, TV and corporates for a couple of decades in one form or another. The past ten years has seen a steady decline in production values and competition for cheap content not quality content.
The tedious back and forth not only does not yield immediate results but often tells me I am dealing with some-one who just wants cheap.
I can work with low-budget, but I don't deal in cheap. Therefore I am more than happy to not waste my time if something is not commercially viable from the outset.
To me that's the right attitude. For someone who is after cheap rather than good value, they may think differently.

As an example, after starting this thread just over the past month I had a Europe-based content buyer approve two talent but after the usual back and forth and arm wrestling over budgets, I could not book the talent and deliver the production quality they expected for an exclusive shoot with their budget limit.
The budget shortfall is significant. The talent categorically did not accept it. So I sent a polite email stating sorry cannot do it, it is not commercially viable, I could not even pay the talent let alone shoot, edit and deliver.
The response was a lecture that defies the commercial demands of quality production on what I should be paying the talent, how it could be shot, it has to be a win/win, there will be more work, etc.
The problem is, what they were offering amounted to minimum wage for the talent and crew for the hours on location and nothing for equipment, insurances, transport, consumables, post production and delivery.
How is that a win/win and why would I want more work for negative income?
Rather than string a producer along and then give them a lecture, the content buyer could just accept at the outset they could not afford the shoot and they should stick to the cheap countries with cheap production values. I can accept the reality of competition and respect that company's business model without getting butt-hurt.
All this could have been in a couple of emails and not a thread of at least 20 emails, sample videos, recent photos, more photos with different wardrobe/costumes, locations etc. etc. etc.

.......

I really did not want to go down this path, but this thread cannot seem to get over the refrain of "antagonistic" or similar accusation.
I presented a topic for discussion, a BUSINESS discussion.
If you look through the thread the push-back is only against the assumptions, judgements and diversions away from that topic.

Here's the conundrum. I cannot criticize what I see as a common practice without most members here probably recognizing they have done exactly this. The human failing is to hit back with "you sound angry" or something similar. No I am not angry, but that is how it gets re-framed, probably to ease the conscience of some.
Then there's a suggestion or two of what other topics I should be posting about that do not really interest me right now.
Go figure, but because I don't leap to someone's off-topic suggestion that makes me antagonistic, too.
Then there's the group think after someone makes an assumption and starts pontificating, a few others jump on board. This is of no interest either, and again I am the one judged to antagonistic.
All these judgements and accusations are very one-way, and all in a topic clearly labelled BUSINESS, no less.
I don't take offense at the judgmental responses because I know that is not what I am doing.
I am just laying out there for everyone to consider, because as you say "I don't see how this helps."

A professional approach would be to just read it for what it is and not attach any emotional assumptions.
In mainstream film and TV staying focused and on track is a desirable characteristic. Here, staying focused and on topic is considered by many a negative characteristic.

Now, let's see how many people can read this and say to themselves, "he's got a point", not take it as a personal slight and come back with a comment related only to the topic, and no personal assumptions or judgements.

[HeidiHoe]

Yeah, you do have a point. It must be tough trying to produce quality at a reasonable rate when you're dealing with individuals that don't know or care what it takes to produce the content. Nowadays there's so many people out there making crappy content that may or may not be legal and selling it for next to nothing. Rates are so depressed, it's amazing you can still find performers as it is. It must suck being you right now.

[Garry2000]

Has the coronavirus affected your business blazemaker?

[BlazeMaker]

Has the coronavirus affected your business blazemaker?

Yes. A big impact on the mainstream work. The industry all but shut down.

It actually prompted more talent to approach me for porn work but we had to wait for restrictions to relax before shooting anything other than solo scenes.

[wetnwild]

Has the coronavirus affected your business blazemaker?

Yes. A big impact on the mainstream work. The industry all but shut down.

It actually prompted more talent to approach me for porn work but we had to wait for restrictions to relax before shooting anything other than solo scenes.

That is interesting my gut feeling would be the porn side would have been hit harder with content and shooting of videos being put on hold.

[rx_tom]

Porn will never shut down, production is back up and running again

[fetishnews]

One good topic if you peeps want to carry on discussing it, I will add my 1 cent if you do. Or let it die up to you.

[Boner]

How many times have you seen a content buyer reach out to a video and photo production company with "Send me your rates"?
A lot, right?
It happens all the time across different forums and discussion threads.

And here is why for a professional production company "Send me your rates" is meaningless:

"Send me your rates" gives the producer no idea if you are after
- 20 minutes of a drug addict masturbating in a cheap motel room, lighting provided by a ceiling fluorescent tube and shot on a cell phone, or
- a 60 minute video with a story, shot with professional 4K camera and crew, professional lighting rig, in different rooms of a glamorous mansion and including the swimming pool and gym, featuring a few healthy babes and athletic guys in all manner of acts, from straight to kink to fetish with associated wardrobe and props.

Unsurprisingly there is a huge difference in "rates", better known as production budgets, for these two scenarios.

So what answer do you expect a experienced producer to provide?

What is useful would be those wishing to purchase content provide a brief covering what they are looking for (scenes, clip duration(s), HD or UHD, number of photos in a photoset, production value such as lighting, locations, raw footage or edited, how it is delivered, the deadline etc. and maybe even a sample clip) and the budget range they usually work on.
This provides a really fast route to "yes we can provide that content for your budget", or "no we can't".

Requesting a quote based on a detailed production brief is a basic business principle in the mainstream film and TV industry but seems to be absent for the most part in adult
The norm in adult is insisting we go through an exchange of a few emails back and forth which often ends up no-where because the content buyer is too inhibited to actually provide details of what they are after, nominate a workable budget and negotiate.

Genuine question: Is there any good reason content buyers cannot let a potential content provider know the budget (or budget range depending on the nature of the clips) upfront?

I get your drift but it is normal for a buyer to ask for rates.

[BlazeMaker]

"I get your drift but it is normal for a buyer to ask for rates."

I agree, but how (and why) is it different to any other purchase when there is a wide range on offer?
No one goes into a car dealership and asks "how much is car?" and expects a price straight away. The sales person wants to know what type of car you were looking to buy, and for what purpose. Then they'd want to know what your budget is.

There's a big difference between a Mitsubishi Mirage Hatchback, a VW Caddy van and a Mercedes Benz Limousine, and it is the same with video production.

[BrentG]

"I get your drift but it is normal for a buyer to ask for rates."

I agree, but how (and why) is it different to any other purchase when there is a wide range on offer?
No one goes into a car dealership and asks "how much is car?" and expects a price straight away. The sales person wants to know what type of car you were looking to buy, and for what purpose. Then they'd want to know what your budget is.

There's a big difference between a Mitsubishi Mirage Hatchback, a VW Caddy van and a Mercedes Benz Limousine, and it is the same with video production.

Have read every post in this thread and I agree with what you are saying.